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Post by Spencer on Dec 29, 2006 2:29:34 GMT -5
Interesting to hear what you guys have to say about this. Being a Giant fan, Im happy. Although it was a shitload of cash.
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Post by KruPaxson on Dec 29, 2006 2:34:11 GMT -5
too much cash and too many years. As a Mets fan I am not upset we didn't land him because what he got was ridiculous. I think Barry Zito is a great pitcher ecspecially coming to the National League. As we discussed today Zito is always healthy, most innings pitched over past 4 seasons, and is like 90-4 when his team scores 4+ runs. Great pickup for the Giants but I think the money could have been spent more wisely. I guess this means Schmidt is done there?
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Post by Spencer on Dec 29, 2006 2:34:55 GMT -5
too much cash and too many years. As a Mets fan I am not upset we didn't land him because what he got was ridiculous. I think Barry Zito is a great pitcher ecspecially coming to the National League. As we discussed today Zito is always healthy, most innings pitched over past 4 seasons, and is like 90-4 when his team scores 4+ runs. Great pickup for the Giants but I think the money could have been spent more wisely. I guess this means Schmidt is done there? Didnt he already sign with LA? Zito Cain Lowry Morris Not too shabby.
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Post by KruPaxson on Dec 29, 2006 2:58:40 GMT -5
not sure i been on vacation from baseball news.
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Post by garf2000 on Dec 29, 2006 3:29:30 GMT -5
ya, being a mets fan i thought it was a lock he was coming here. byrnes was on espn radio today and supposedly said that for almost 3 years zito has been talking about how playing for the mets has been his dream... but i cannot blame minaya/wilpons for not shelling out 125 mil for 7 years, just way way too much
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Post by KruPaxson on Dec 29, 2006 3:32:07 GMT -5
hmm thats the first report i hear of zito wanting to be a met...i like the espn radio listen though see we hook up our listeners with free college bball tickets
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Post by Lumley316 on Dec 29, 2006 4:26:50 GMT -5
Yes Jason signed with the Dodgers Spencer, yea that was a shitload of money but Zito doesnt have the DH to deal with in the NL so it should help inflate his stats. I glad he didnt sign with the Rangers helps my Angels out.
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Post by Bender on Dec 29, 2006 4:31:21 GMT -5
interesting to see what the yankees do with johnson now
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Post by nybombers3 on Dec 29, 2006 9:16:09 GMT -5
Great signing.
Yankees aren't going to overpay him and don't have to see him anymore.
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Post by Dan on Dec 29, 2006 11:57:38 GMT -5
i thought it was a great signing on there part, maybe a little to much money, but i dont think you can ever go wrong with a pitcher like him. Cant wait for the yankees to trade randy, ohhh that great day
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Post by Spencer on Dec 29, 2006 12:08:48 GMT -5
The Giants are just ancient on offense. Any major injuries with the starting lineup and theyre doomed.
C-Molina 1B-Aurilia-Klesko 2B-Durham 3B-Feliz SS-Vizquel LF-Bonds CF-Roberts RF-Winn
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Post by Mark on Dec 29, 2006 12:16:15 GMT -5
No, it wasn't a great signing. There was no reason for that team to give him that kind of money. They are not a pitcher away from being a serious contender. They have multiple holes and a ridiculously old team, and just decided to throw all of their money into a glorified number two starter? There are almost no pitchers worth that kind of money, even on this pathetic market. No one gets seven years (eight as an option, I believe) and no one gets that type of cash per. Zito just got his money off of reputation and his 01-03 seasons. Nice, that was three years ago. Since then, he has settled into a solid, durable pitcher. Valuable, but not even close to that price tag.
As a Mets fan, I wanted him because the team clearly needs to add a starter to the rotation. I still see that starter coming, likely through trade (Lastings, Pelfrey, Humber, Heilman, maybe even Gomez, etc) because the FA market is now riddled with crap (Redman, Pineiro, etc). I had in my mind that I'd essentially give him anything, thinking that 'anything' would be a 6th year (something the papers were all bitching about, that Texas and NY wouldn't assure him the 6th year) and 100+ million (6 years 100 million would have been fine with me). But, for that price tag.. enjoy him.
Coming to the NL will obviously help him, but SBC park is overrated in terms of being a heavy pitchers park. It's actually pretty neutral (as is Oakland's stadium). Going to the NL will likely lower Zito's ERA into the 3.40-3.60 range, with 15+ wins, and a ridiculous contract. Enjoy him for the next two seasons, and then watch the trade rumors unfold as San Fran tries to get out from underneath that deal.
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Post by nybombers3 on Dec 29, 2006 12:23:39 GMT -5
Of course it was a great signing. Again, the Yankees don't have to overpay his ass and the Yankees don't have to face his ass. All that = Great.
Fuck the Giants.
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Post by Spencer on Dec 29, 2006 13:02:51 GMT -5
Im not too worried about the contract long term. It gives them 4 very good starters now, and the ability to use Lowry or Sanchez as trade bait for a young bat. The Giants have some decent youth in the minors, but for the most part theyll just recycle older guys and try to win it every year. But ya, basically they need everything to click just right to win the division.
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Post by Mark on Dec 29, 2006 13:08:52 GMT -5
Of course it was a great signing. Again, the Yankees don't have to overpay his ass and the Yankees don't have to face his ass. All that = Great. Fuck the Giants. Yankees murdered him every year since that one playoff start like, six years ago. Absolutely murdered the guy.
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Post by Spencer on Dec 29, 2006 13:10:31 GMT -5
Giants OF defense should be horrible this year, which is a concern for a fly ball guy like Zito.
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Post by Dan on Dec 29, 2006 13:26:02 GMT -5
No, it wasn't a great signing. There was no reason for that team to give him that kind of money. They are not a pitcher away from being a serious contender. They have multiple holes and a ridiculously old team, and just decided to throw all of their money into a glorified number two starter? There are almost no pitchers worth that kind of money, even on this pathetic market. No one gets seven years (eight as an option, I believe) and no one gets that type of cash per. Zito just got his money off of reputation and his 01-03 seasons. Nice, that was three years ago. Since then, he has settled into a solid, durable pitcher. Valuable, but not even close to that price tag. As a Mets fan, I wanted him because the team clearly needs to add a starter to the rotation. I still see that starter coming, likely through trade (Lastings, Pelfrey, Humber, Heilman, maybe even Gomez, etc) because the FA market is now riddled with crap (Redman, Pineiro, etc). I had in my mind that I'd essentially give him anything, thinking that 'anything' would be a 6th year (something the papers were all bitching about, that Texas and NY wouldn't assure him the 6th year) and 100+ million (6 years 100 million would have been fine with me). But, for that price tag.. enjoy him. Coming to the NL will obviously help him, but SBC park is overrated in terms of being a heavy pitchers park. It's actually pretty neutral (as is Oakland's stadium). Going to the NL will likely lower Zito's ERA into the 3.40-3.60 range, with 15+ wins, and a ridiculous contract. Enjoy him for the next two seasons, and then watch the trade rumors unfold as San Fran tries to get out from underneath that deal. hi im smark kelley i know everything about baseball
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Post by aaronjh on Dec 29, 2006 13:28:16 GMT -5
No, it wasn't a great signing. There was no reason for that team to give him that kind of money. They are not a pitcher away from being a serious contender. They have multiple holes and a ridiculously old team, and just decided to throw all of their money into a glorified number two starter? There are almost no pitchers worth that kind of money, even on this pathetic market. No one gets seven years (eight as an option, I believe) and no one gets that type of cash per. Zito just got his money off of reputation and his 01-03 seasons. Nice, that was three years ago. Since then, he has settled into a solid, durable pitcher. Valuable, but not even close to that price tag. As a Mets fan, I wanted him because the team clearly needs to add a starter to the rotation. I still see that starter coming, likely through trade (Lastings, Pelfrey, Humber, Heilman, maybe even Gomez, etc) because the FA market is now riddled with crap (Redman, Pineiro, etc). I had in my mind that I'd essentially give him anything, thinking that 'anything' would be a 6th year (something the papers were all bitching about, that Texas and NY wouldn't assure him the 6th year) and 100+ million (6 years 100 million would have been fine with me). But, for that price tag.. enjoy him. Coming to the NL will obviously help him, but SBC park is overrated in terms of being a heavy pitchers park. It's actually pretty neutral (as is Oakland's stadium). Going to the NL will likely lower Zito's ERA into the 3.40-3.60 range, with 15+ wins, and a ridiculous contract. Enjoy him for the next two seasons, and then watch the trade rumors unfold as San Fran tries to get out from underneath that deal. hi im smark kelley i know everything about baseball You crack me up. Wanna ball today?
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Post by duce on Dec 29, 2006 14:03:53 GMT -5
mark had good points, but if you really think money is the issue this off-season you had to be under a rock. the giants were going to overpay many more people if they didn't do it for zito... at least this way they get an ace - shaky or not.
i think just personel-wise, SF absolutely had to do it. the staff was hung out to dry when schmidt who i feel has an elite arm, left for LA. i mean who knows what zito will turn out as but more than likely he'll have 3 or 4 great or even outstanding years for this team.
ANY time you get a great pitcher it's a great signing. i understand it was too much money but that's the way it's going right now in baseball.
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Post by Mark on Dec 29, 2006 14:04:33 GMT -5
No, it wasn't a great signing. There was no reason for that team to give him that kind of money. They are not a pitcher away from being a serious contender. They have multiple holes and a ridiculously old team, and just decided to throw all of their money into a glorified number two starter? There are almost no pitchers worth that kind of money, even on this pathetic market. No one gets seven years (eight as an option, I believe) and no one gets that type of cash per. Zito just got his money off of reputation and his 01-03 seasons. Nice, that was three years ago. Since then, he has settled into a solid, durable pitcher. Valuable, but not even close to that price tag. As a Mets fan, I wanted him because the team clearly needs to add a starter to the rotation. I still see that starter coming, likely through trade (Lastings, Pelfrey, Humber, Heilman, maybe even Gomez, etc) because the FA market is now riddled with crap (Redman, Pineiro, etc). I had in my mind that I'd essentially give him anything, thinking that 'anything' would be a 6th year (something the papers were all bitching about, that Texas and NY wouldn't assure him the 6th year) and 100+ million (6 years 100 million would have been fine with me). But, for that price tag.. enjoy him. Coming to the NL will obviously help him, but SBC park is overrated in terms of being a heavy pitchers park. It's actually pretty neutral (as is Oakland's stadium). Going to the NL will likely lower Zito's ERA into the 3.40-3.60 range, with 15+ wins, and a ridiculous contract. Enjoy him for the next two seasons, and then watch the trade rumors unfold as San Fran tries to get out from underneath that deal. hi im smark kelley i know everything about baseball Mark Kelley. And yup.
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Post by manasrai on Dec 29, 2006 15:05:36 GMT -5
I agree with Mark. 3 years from now everyone will wonder what in the world the Giants were thinking by giving this contract. He's not even worth that money in the first year of the contract...
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Post by Mark on Dec 29, 2006 15:27:37 GMT -5
mark had good points, but if you really think money is the issue this off-season you had to be under a rock. the giants were going to overpay many more people if they didn't do it for zito... at least this way they get an ace - shaky or not.
No they weren't, there was no one left to overpay. The money this offseason was ridiculous, but that didn't mean they had to become apart of it. The Mets didn't. I don't really buy the argument that money isn't a factor this off season because of how ridiculous the prices are. What about next year? Or the year after? Or whenever the salaries even out? They will be tied into a number two starter making uber-ace money. As for them getting an ace.. they really didn't. If Zito is an ace in numbers and performance (and not just in name), than there are enough aces around to keep from paying one 120+ million over 7 years.
i think just personel-wise, SF absolutely had to do it. the staff was hung out to dry when schmidt who i feel has an elite arm, left for LA.
They had to go hard for Zito. Did they have to out-bid everyone else by 1-2 years, and 30-40 million? No. More likely that Boras got them to believe there were other offers out there, ala A-Rod after the 2000 season. And Schmidt is a borderline elite arm, so that loss definitely had to be filled. But for a team who isn't going to contend for a WS, I don't see the logic in tying up so much money to this pitcher, who isn't putting the team over the top. Not even close.
i mean who knows what zito will turn out as but more than likely he'll have 3 or 4 great or even outstanding years for this team.
That's not even close to more than likely. Look at his track record. He's had 1 outstanding year in his career (02), and it really was great. Then he had two arguably (but that really is pushing it) great years in 01 and 03. His 00 was a little short to be considered, but he was damn good that year too. Since then, he's had a borderline bad season, and two above average ones. A switch from the AL to the NL will help, but if they're banking on 3-4 great or outstanding seasons out of him, they either have a much different definition of great and outstanding than me, or are looking at a different pitcher. He'll put up a 3.30-3.70 era, with 15+ wins, and pitch 200 innings. He's a very good pitcher. He's not an ace, which he was paid as. He's probably not even the best pitcher on that staff right now.
ANY time you get a great pitcher it's a great signing. i understand it was too much money but that's the way it's going right now in baseball.
Anytime you get a great pitcher it's a great addition. Doesn't make it a great signing. It was a horrendous signing. Very good addition. Obviously you'd like to add Zito. I wanted Zito for the Mets, at a reasonable cost. But I don't think teams need to fall into the trap of 'that's the way it is going in baseball' to overpay. There will be other free agents, superior ones. No need for that contract.
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dahkman
Starter
Heat - Marlins
Posts: 1,312
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Post by dahkman on Dec 29, 2006 17:10:07 GMT -5
great deal for san fran...in a weak division so they dont need much anyway and zito cain and lowry can be nasty in the playoffs...cause all u really need in the playoffs is 3 really good sps and the gaints got that i believe... although my marlins will win it all this year so it doesnt matter
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Post by JDawg on Dec 29, 2006 22:08:19 GMT -5
i was gonna make a thread about zito, but you beat to the task. anyway, zito for that money is a joke. thank you mets for not giving him that much money, he is not worth the money. Zito is gonna regret being with san fran when they stink up the joint for years to come. oh well, sucks for him. boras you are such a jerk-off, there were possibilities on the mets for championships.
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Post by Spencer on Dec 29, 2006 22:40:28 GMT -5
Zito likes the area, and the Giants will continue to spend to at least try and be a contender. Overall, I like the move. I still think this is a better signing then the Soriano contract.
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